RTY 2.0

[BenjiPM]

Oh, now I see what you mean. Yeah, I suppose TCon does sort of demand attention.

On another subject, what's your opinion on [REDACTED]?

[Edit] Forget I said anything, Magical Crops is a grindy pain in the rear I'd rather not deal with.

[nickmaster00]

Well, nothing else to say here, let's wrap up and wait until the pack is ready.

[Katrix]

@Both of you

Read what I wrote again, I listed the 3 main mods focuses in RTY 2.0. Not where to get tools, but what mods you basically have to do in RTY 2.0. It's true that there are other tools around there that doesn't come from those mods. Maybe you got a pickaxe from Twilight Forest, a useful tool from The End or a powerful magical artifact from Blood Magic. That's not what I focus on here. In this case I ask, how long will this mod follow you and how much will you interact with it. These mods are what you might call main atraction mods. They add the flesh to the modpack. Then there are mods like Bibliocraft, OpenBlocks, Ehanched Portals, Natura, Carpenters Blocks and others that add in something very specific. They are usually smaller mods that you might visit from time to time, but they are not the main attraction. These are what you might call side attraction mods. What is very important here is that the side attraction mods don't keep mostly for themselves. They are completely fine with giving you a alternate tool from time to time, but they shouldn't try to take over a part of one of the main attraction mods. I consider TiC such a mod, and I also consider it as trying to take over from other mods.

As for more interesting weapons, it MIGHT be that SOMETIMES in the future, you might for example get a shield or a spear for cleaing a quest for SOMEONE. In generalness tough, I try to solve this by giving you several options in tools. Do you want a drill or a magic picaxe, do you want the faster drill, or the one with Fortune 3 on it? Believe me, there is not just one go to tool, you have to choose that yourself.

@Nick

They might not be as OP as those tools and armours, but then there is also the fact that you don't need 1 or more Nether stars per piece. Each piece of Ichor requires one Nether star. Same for Iridium Plates.

[nickmaster00]

This is the moment where we should ask ourselves - How it is to be the Admin of a modded server?-

Okno, still, I think that is not OP is just a little bit less longer than mods like IC2-Gravisuit, Thaumcraft-Thaumic Tinkerer and Thermal Expansion-Redstone Arsenal and that in fact is the reason why people want it so much, because even though u can customize your work you can do bigger and better things, and still, the thing is not about ores, because you can easily set an Ender Quarry that does all the work for you and then puts it into your ME system, but it adds the sense of customization and the fact that there are no OP items (because the best item is not a Full-Steel Hammer) but that you can give your touch to the weapons, through the techy or through the magic way.

[BenjiPM]

I guess what you've said makes sense, although since IC2 and RF mods are both Technology mods, should they really be considered separate?

Sorry if it seems like I'm trying to push the issue too much, I've just always been fond of the hands-on, more detailed weapon-making system of TCon. Minecraft weapon-making is just lacking to me, I guess; when all I do to make a sword is put metal and sticks into a table it doesn't feel like I've done much, but with TCon tools the work I do to make tools makes them feel more special to me. As I said before though, the choice to add or not is yours to make, not mine; all I can do is respect your decision and understand that you have your reasons.

Also, Katrix, in an earlier post you said "TContruct: Can be kind of OP. Convince me". I guess I may have taken that as a challenge; sorry if I came across as hard-headed at any point. If I haven't conviced you yet, there's nothing else I can do.

[nickmaster00]

RTY 2.0

Ok, let's think about this, there is Thaumcraft, that is the way of doing things by magic, where you can get tools like the Pickaxe of the Core and the Shovel of the Earthmover, these are tools done by magic that work with magic.

There is IC2, that is the way of doing things by technology, where you can get tools like the Drill and the Chainsaw, these tools are done with technology and work with energy.

Now, where is the traditional way of doing things, like an old school blacksmith, well that is what TConstruct has to offer, another way of doing the things, easier?... Maybe, but it is another way of doing stuff, that's leads to the same path because of its addons and bla bla bla but it is still a pretty balanced mod if you think about it.

EDIT: mhmm, *cough cough* these are the only tools that work with RF *cough* excepting the Famous Redstone Arsenal. *cough*

EDIT2: Could I have a list of the mods that you added/discarded recently pls... [emoji4]

[Katrix]

@Benji

Ehhhh, noo. It's very easy to smelt the ores beforehand in other ore doubling machines. The problem doesn't lie with TiC, but whit the balance of the entire modpack. An alternative would be to disable all high tier metals, and dropping the slots down to one. At the time when you really began to get to use TiC, the game is supposed to be quite hard.

There is also the problem with numbers of mods. At the moment the modpack is a quarter GB large. That's huge, and I'd rather try to shrink it than to make it bigger at this point. There is also the feel of the modpack that I am kind of afraid of. The modpack currently have 3 main mid focuses. The first on is IC, that is the smalles focus, the second focus is all RF mods. The third focus is Thaumcraft. I feel that TiC is such a big mod that it would shift this balance a bit too much.

[BenjiPM]

So I just checked the config file for TConstruct out of curiosity, and guess what I found? A setting called "Ingots per ore" which controls the "Number of ingots returned from smelting ores in the smeltery". Just set that to 1 instead of 2 and problem solved, right?

[nickmaster00]

AHHHH, The Admin is here, Everybody RUUUUN!!

Okno

But still, through addons like TMechworks that add more stuff like drawbridges and things like that there is the possibility of increasing the "longevity" of the mod.

But Katrix, I know perfectly how you want this modpack to be (and we have had this conversation before, lol), but still, there has to be something (Only one little thing) that is not endgame but is still very useful indeed, and I think that is what Benji is trying to say through this posts.

[Katrix]

While it might be true that the tools are a bit more expensive, as soon as you get any ore doubling down, these numbers will still be pretty easy to get. It is at this point not that it is OP in itself, but that it will allow a earlier endgame. RTY 2.0 is a pack where the true endgame comes very late. That is the way it is supposed to be. I don't want to shorten that gap by adding this.

EDIT: So what do I consider balanced? If I were to add this mod, I would at the least double the amount of materials that is required for most of the tools. Once you get a fair bit into the game, 30 ingots are nothing. Most likely you will at some point just want to throw it in the trash can. Maybe I could add a nether stay to some of the more end game resources, that would balance it out with everything else.

[nickmaster00]

Ew, I don't think it can be disabled, but anyway...
Is not that I don't want it to be added, but I have to be objective about the mods that are entering into the pack, considering the fact that is going to be very hardcore to get stuff.

[BenjiPM]

There's probably a way to disable the RF repair thing, if need be.

By the way nick, for someone who wants the mod added, you sure are good at thinking of reasons why it might not be. T_T

[nickmaster00]

I think that the main reason of not adding TC is its compatibility with Thermal Expansion, because you can basically repair your tools with RF energy, and that makes things a lot easier, still, I want this mod to be added.

[BenjiPM]

I think maybe it looks OP if you only consider the things it adds without considering the amount of time and effort that has to be put into making them. I've always felt that by the time I've made, say, a hammer, I've earned the benefits of it because I managed to collect all the materials for it and make all the other stuff needed, like part casts and the smeltery. Sure, hammers are way better than pickaxes (except if you need precision), but they take a ton more work than just putting sticks and ingots into a table.

[nickmaster00]

Now that you put it in that way, I mean, I love Tinkers' Construct, but the concept of the OP weapons has changed (at least for me) throughout the years, I am sure that there are reasons different that saying -TConstruct too OP, pls nerf- but I am not the one to answer you that question, anyway, if Katrix finally decides to add this mod I will be very pleased and happy.